Dr. Tim Mounce, co-host of the All Things Unexplained podcast, will moderate the historic, first-ever “Roswell vs. Washington” UFO debate on Friday, Oct. 10, 2025, an event that highlights Washington state’s key role in the nation’s UFO legacy.
The live debate, starting at 6 p.m. PDT (7 p.m. MDT) and held in Truth or Consequences, New Mexico, will explore the rival histories of 1947’s “Summer of the Saucers,” including Roswell and two Washington state sightings:
- Kenneth Arnold’s June 1947 UFO sighting over Mt. Rainer
- The Maury Island incident on June 21, 1947
In a Sept. 11 post on X, Mounce announced that he would moderate the event, calling it “historic” and saying it will put “UFOs on trial” and challenge accepted history.
Steve Edmiston, co-founder of the Men in Black Birthday Bash in Des Moines, screenwriter of The Maury Island Incident film, and a Washington representative at the debate, said in a statement:
“We’re so excited – and fortunate – that Dr. Tim Mounce can moderate this debate. His expertise and passion for the UFO history is evident from his body of work. We want this event to be both serious and fun – a difficult balance – and Dr. Mounce is perfect.”
According to organizers, the debate will jointly address questions and controversies over the legacy of 1947’s UFO incidents. A joint statement said the disagreements focus on the “facts, circumstances, and competing historical legacies and pop-culture significance” of Roswell, Arnold’s Mount Rainier sighting, and Maury Island, which featured the origins of the so-called “Men in Black.”
Mounce is a former professor, author, narrator, and investigator of UFOs and Bigfoot. His All Things Unexplained podcast has been a People’s Choice Award nominee, a Top 15 Science & Society show, and ranked among the Top 100 UFO podcasts worldwide.
More information about the event is available at www.quadrant45.com/roswell-vs-washington and on Facebook.
Here’s the Joint Statement:
A JOINT STATEMENT BETWEEN WASHINGTON STATE’S UFO-UFO (UNITED FESTIVALS OF UFOs) AND THE RESIDENT RESEARCHERS OF ROSWELL, NM
“The undersigned representatives of UFO-UFO of Washington State, and UFO researchers of Roswell, NM, have agreed, following extensive negotiations, to jointly and publicly address long-standing questions and controversies (some might say, grievances) relating to the history, mythology, and legacy of the 1947 Summer of the Saucers, specifically including incidents (both famous and infamous) occurring in Roswell, New Mexico, Mt. Rainier Washington, and Maury Island, Washington. To do so, the parties will hold a public debate on October 10, 2025, in Truth or Consequences, New Mexico.
“This Joint Statement is provided to frame this debate. We hope the world is watching.
“WHAT WE CAN AGREE ON
“1. culture:
“The summer of 1947 gave the world three iconic UFO incidents that forever altered popular
• “On June 21, 1947, marine scavenger Harold Dahl and crew spotted six unidentified donut-shaped objects flying near Tacoma, WA. One of the objects appeared to be in distress and expelled molten slag onto the eyewitnesses, burning the arm of Harold’s son and killing their dog. The next day, a mysterious man dressed head-to-foot in black appeared on Dahl’s doorstep and issued a warning not to tell anyone what he had seen or bad things would happen. Dahl ignored the warning. Bad things happened, ultimately including the tragic deaths of two Army-Air Force intelligence officers while investigating Dahl’s sighting. And the world first learned of the mysterious Men In Black.
• “On June 24, 1947, businessman and pilot Kenneth Arnold flew out of the airport in Chehalis, WA on his way back home to Boise, ID. On the way, Arnold spotted nine unidentified aircraft near Mt. Rainier flying in echelon formation at a speed of 1,700 mph – a speed unheard of at the time. Later, when asked about how these mysterious objects flew, Arnold described their flight movement, saying that “they flew erratic, like a saucer if you skip it across the water” – and at that moment the term “flying saucer” became part of the American lexicon.
• “In early July 1947 (although some will insist the correct date is in June), an unidentified flying object crashed on a ranch operated by Mack Brazel near Corona, NM, leaving a debris field of unknown metallic material along its trajectory to a distant point of rest.
“Upon hearing of this report, intelligence officers from the nearby Roswell Army Air Field visited the site to collect some of the wreckage. The base then issued an extraordinary press release, encapsulated in the local Roswell newspaper’s headline: “RAAF Captures Flying Saucer On Ranch in Roswell Region.” Within a matter of hours, higher military authorities refuted the story, claiming that the debris was from a crashed weather balloon. Since then, “Roswell” has become synonymous with a government conspiracy to conceal the truth of extraterrestrial visitation to the planet – and arguably has become the most famous UFO-incident in history.
“2. We recognize that UFOs have become big business. Every other day it seems a new whistleblower emerges to expose some deep-dish conspiracy that the U.S. government possessestechnology or biological specimens from crashed UAPs. Extraterrestrial characters – from the adorable to the atrocious – grace our multiplexes, smart TVs, and handheld devices. The image of the “flying saucer” is every bit as recognizable as the Golden Arches or Mickey Mouse.
“3. Our UFO-laden popular culture (including depictions of the “Men in Black”) is directly descended from the events of 1947 – with very little change in terminology, look-and-feel, and storytelling. While much of 1947’s remarkable UFO history has been accurately captured and shared, much has not, and there are significant areas of disagreement.
“4. Central to our disagreements are the facts, circumstances, and competing legacies of Roswell, Kenneth Arnold’s Mt. Rainier sighting, and Maury Island.
WHERE WE DIFFER
“1. Who’s to blame (or credit) for launching the 1947 Summer of the Saucers? Is it the businessman pilot who first brought these objects to the public attention? Is it the unfortunate Maury Island eyewitness who failed to heed the warning of the Man In Black? Or could it be the long shadow of Roswell, obscuring all that has come before or since?
“2. Do the current legacies of these three 1947 events accurately reflect their true historical and mythological importance?
“3. Why did the original World UFO Day change from June 24 (Mt. Rainier) to July 2 (Roswell), and who are the unidentified people of WUFUDO that claim to have caused that change?
“4. Was the assertion of “hoax” in relation to Maury Island in fact a false-flag operation endorsed by J. Edgar Hoover’s FBI?
“WHAT NOW?
“These important questions, and others of less importance, will be debated on October 10, 2025, in the neutral territory of Truth Or Consequences, NM, at the Truth or Consequences Brewery.
“On one side, UFO-UFO, representing Washington State’s role in kickstarting the modern UFO phenomenon. And on the other side, Roswell, the town that took that phenomenon to the bank.
“The winner will know the truth.
“The loser, consequences.
“EFFECTIVE June 6, 2025:
• Paul T. Semones – Roswell, NM
• Toby Martinez – Roswell, NM
• Jason Mattson – Chehalis, WA
• Vince Ynzunza – Tacoma, WA
• Steve Edmiston – Des Moines, WA”
